The rise and fall of 'America's Dad'
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In this exciting and dramatic conversation on race, I’m joined by Amr Awadallah former VP of developer relations for Google Cloud, and Sara Speer Selber, CEO of Quest Essential. Amr, a Muslim who was born in Egypt, and Sara, a Jewish woman born in the US. We talk about the ability to change and the need to allow people to change instead of canceling them for what they thought or did in the past.
Amr was fired from Google after he wrote a paper called “We Are One,” about how he used to not like Jewish people because of what he had heard about Jewish people as he grew up. But after meeting and getting to know Jewish people and even finding out he had Jewish DNA he changed his thinking. Some other employees at Google accused him of antisemitism. We talk about social justice, the need for education, and the importance of eradicating racism, antisemitism, homophobia, Islamophobia, and other hate, it’s hypocritical and dangerous to “cancel,” fire, or ban people who have changed. If we can’t admit to past mistakes without fear, it will be almost impossible to get other people to let go of racism, etc.
Sara Speer Selber shares how she was raised to agree with everything Israel did and not like Muslims. After getting to know Muslim women and hearing about a group called Salaam Shalom which brought Muslim and Jewish women together, she began to change her thinking. She went on to help start a chapter of Salaam Shalom in Texas where she lives.
Key topics:
[4:42] Amr tells his story of what he used to think about Jewish people and what happened to make him change and get to know Jewish people.
[9:07] What happened when Simma was part of a Jewish-Palestinian dialogue group and the support she got from Palestinians when her partner died. The Palestinians in the group attended the Jewish services.
[10:39] The stories Amr heard about Jewish people that shaped his thinking growing up.
[12:10] How Sara met Amr when they were both on a Clubhouse for two weeks where Palestinians and Israelis shared their stories. Sara heard Amr talk about what happened to him at Google and she reached out to him.
[17:06] Amr was in a deep depression about being fired and when Sara reached out to him it lifted his spirits. He talks about how he was impacted by all the Jewish people who reached out to him.
[34.02] Why we all need to work together against climate change which can kill us all. When we hate and refuse to interact it stops us from moving forward and we can all be destroyed.
[37.27] How the Muslim community came together in Texas to support the Rabbi and worshippers in the synagogue when people were taken hostage.
Guests Bio
Sara Speer Selber, Founding Partner of QuestEssential, has more than 40 years of experience managing people and organizations for excellence and success. Her career with for profit and non-profit entities has been characterized by entrepreneurial innovation and has been recognized repeatedly by professional and community groups for her business achievements and many contributions to the welfare of others.
Dr. Amr Awadallah is the CEO and cofounder of ZIR AI, a company that is revolutionizing how we seek knowledge across all languages of the world. He previously served as VP of Developer Relations for Google Cloud until July 2021. Prior to joining Google in Nov 2019, Amr co-founded Cloudera in 2008 and as Global CTO, he spent 11 years working closely with enterprises around the world on how to ingest and extract value from big data (he famously coined the terms “schema-on-read vs schema-on-write”).
Sumi Mukherjee was bullied and tormented all his young life for his skin color, ethnicity, and Indian name. Let's hear how his experiences compelled him to write about his life to help other people of color.
Key Topics
[4:25] His first experience with race and racism was in elementary school. Being raised in an all-white city in Plymouth, Minnesota.
People knew about white and black people but nothing about people from India.
How his family tried everything to fit in as part of America by celebrating Christmas, putting up a tree, etc. but he was accepted.
His shock at not being treated as an equal but being bullied by racists in school.
The trauma of racist attacks by white kids at school
He says he was the diversity of the school.
[10:31] Although he had provisional economic privilege because of his family background, it did not negate the color of his skin, nor the outpour of hate against him and his parents.
[12:20] How he was bullied, made fun of, and attacked because of his name Sumi. They also made fun of his last name, Mukherjee.
Having to explain his background to people who had no understanding of who he was.
[16:50] The terror of being harassed at night by people constantly calling his house making fun of his name and being targeted by racists.
The trauma of living through racism for all people of color.
[20:14] The effect on his self-esteem and mental health.
How he was traumatized, the impact on his mental health, and developing OCD.
The trauma of racism impacts all people of color and is life-long. It needs to be recognized and discussed.
Sumi has had to deal with low self-esteem, feeling isolated and afraid. He has gotten help with mental health issues and fears. Today he writes and talks to people about racism, bullying, and getting through racial trauma.
[24:54] What parents need to know to help their kids who are being bullied due to race. The importance of taking it seriously and not telling kids to ignore it.
What white parents need to do to help their kids be allies and support their friends of color who are being bullied or attacked.
[39:02] Sumi shares his struggles with trying to win white people over to like him. It shouldn’t be the responsibility of people of color to win people over.
How do you motivate people to care?
Sumi Bio
Author and Speaker Sumi Mukherjee published his first book titled “A Life Interrupted – the story of my battle with bullying and obsessive compulsive disorder” in July 2011. His second book published in July 2014, is titled “Father Figure – my mission to prevent child sexual abuse”. His third book titled “How to stand up to workplace bullying and take on an unjust employer” was published in Jan 2017. His fourth and the latest book titled “Minority Viewpoint – my experience, as a person of color, with the American Justice System” was published in Dec 2020.
In our Season 5 finale: What’s the cultural transformation we need to make — in the West, and the U.S. in particular — to live in good health with the rest of the natural world and with each other? Episode 11 of The Repair, our series on the climate emergency.
Researched and produced by John Biewen, with co-host Amy Westervelt. Script editor, Cheryl Devall. Interviews with Dirk Philipsen, Christian Felber, Olúfẹ́mi Táíwò, and Jessica Hernandez. Music by Lili Haydn, Kim Carroll, Chris Westlake, Lesley Barber, Cora Miron, Fabian Almazan, and Alex Weston. Music consulting by Joe Augustine of Narrative Music.
Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choicesThe first of two concluding episodes in Season 5, in which we focus on solutions. In Part 10 of The Repair, we look at the actions and policies that people need to push for —now — to avoid the most catastrophic effects of climate change.
Reported by Amy Westervelt. Script editor, Cheryl Devall. Production and mix by John Biewen. Interviews with Kate Marvel, Ken Caldeira, Julian Brave Noisecat, Kate Aronoff, Naomi Klein, Julia Steinberger, Leah Stokes, Heidi Marmon, Tamara Toles O’Laughlin, Rhiana Gunn-Wright, Tara Houska, and Max Berger. Music in this episode by Lili Haydn, Kim Caroll, Chris Westlake, Lesley Barber, Cora Miron, goodnight Lucas, and Maetar. Music consulting by Joe Augustine of Narrative Music.
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